Select Member<br>2014-2015 Deer Hunting Contest W
Ok, I'm going to take my bow and rifle when I go elk hunting. What ammo do you guys think I should shoot in a .300 WSM? Do you think 150 gr. is enough for a cow elk?
One of the things that blew my mind on my first trip to Colorado was the number of Locals in the Rifle area didn't carry magnums. 30-30 leverguns, 38-55 lever guns, the 30-06 and .270 were everywhere. One of the biggest 4x4's I saw that year was taken out by 15 year old local with a .243 Winchester using a 100gr bullet.
Shot placement and bullet construction. Even though you may have the opportunity to take much closer shots, I would prepare for the long ones and use something that penetrates well. Slow moving heavy bullets don't need to be fancy bullets to penetrate well and fast moving fancy bullets tend to "blow up" at short ranges.
How could you go wrong with a simple power point or core-lok? Anything...150,165,180. Any of them will fit the bill.
I was not trying to argue or start an argument. The man asked what bullet to use for his 300 WSM. I answered that I shot a 300 WM that is close to his caliber and merrily made a suggestion for a bullet that has put lots of elk meat in the freezer for me. As some have all ready stated, elk have been taken from everything from a speer to as what you call the Super Hot Stuff Magnum. Also if you want to make light of the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation efforts on providing habitat for elk and other birds and animals that live in that Eco system, go right ahead. You are in Iraq fighting for that right and I respect that. I also suggested for him to use a bullet for those cases when an elk will not be standing broad side at close range and to think of the worse case scenario but yet still be in range of when you would need a bullet for any given caliber to reach the vital areas for a kill. Also penetration has a lot more to do than just sectional density alone. You also have to factor in velocity and foot pounds of energy at any given range. I doubt if Bayman is going to go out and buy a rifle of another caliber as I when he all ready has one suitable to kill an elk. The difference between penetration of a 180gr Nosler partition with a muzzle velocity of 3100 fps vs the 200 gr Nosler partition at 2900 fps is slight. When you need to break up bones and penetration on dangerous game at short range the 200 grain or heavier bullet would be the choice. The flatter shooting 180 grain bullet is more suitable for the chance of an extreme range you may encounter when hunting elk.I don't care if it's a .300 Win-Fed-Super hot stuff magnum with Rocky Mountain Tick endorsement. Sectional density and velocity will always determine penetration. A little 260 Remington with a 140grain bullet with a sectional density of .287 bests the 300 Mag using 180 grain partitians when it comes to penetration. You have to shoot a 200 grain bullets out of that magnum .30 cal. to even get close. A 180 grain .30 cal spire point might have a sectional density of .271. Not as good as a 154 grain 7mm or a 150 grain .270. Heck even a .257 Roberts little 120 grainers have a sectional density better than 150 or 165 grain .30 calibers.
So what does this prove? If your arguement is you need maximum penetration to kill an elk you're handicapping yourself by not shooting a cartridge that uses heavier than bore bullets.
Or you could just say that a Rocky Mountain Elk is not an armored animal and people have been taking them down many years before there was a Nosler, Barnes, or a Speer. Don't beat up your shoulder. And don't fall victim to magnum hype. My largest elk to date fell victim to a 7mm-08 using 140 grain handloaded jacketed bullet. Just a plain old piece of copper-tin alloy covered lead. Almost 300 yards away and never took a step. If you have your freezer full of meat in December, who's gonna care what bullet you used.
The recoil factor is what gets me on the big guns. If I'm jerking the trigger and closing my eyes, I can't hit squat anyway. So I just go with the old 270.catdaddylong. Man I know what you mean. I was just responding to something that gets me going. Your response is what I try to avoid. The ft lbs of energy a bullet has when it strikes a target at a given range is the same thing that Colorado DOW seems to have confusion with also.
A bullets style (meplat and ogive) will have little affect on how the bullet penetrates whether it has a thousand or two thousand ft lbs of energy. It's all about sectional density. It's like taking a hammer and attempting to drive something into wood. A nail works best, but trying to drive 3/8 bolt tends to be more difficult. Lets say that 264 pushing 1700 ft lbs of energy would be the nail, and the 300 would be the 3.8 bolt. That's the trick with sectional density. Bullets that are heavy for bore size have better sectional density.
I do agree however that that 2111 ft lbs of energy is a monster but my point is that based off of the sectional density of the 300 that little 6.5 is still able to penetrate deeper at less energy than the 300 will with almost 400 more ft lbs of energy. I think the state of Colorado just requires projectiles to have 550 ft lbs of energy at 50 yards.
Just mention the name Wiskey Chamberlain from Idaho to any Idaho Elk Hunter and they may refer to him as the 243 Winchester guy. I think the guy may have taken 15 or more bulls with the old 243, and at some pretty good distances.
I'm not attempting to argue with anyone. I just see too many hunters out there who are convinced that you have to bring out the heavy guns to take elk size game. It's not the case. The mass media telecommercial known to many as The Outdoor Channel seems to fuel the fire when it comes to this misbelief also.
The 300 short mag that bayman spoke of is more than enough to take elk at any distance. It has the ability to send a standard spire-pointed bullet weighing 150 grains at enough speed and energy to take out elk easily at ranges of 500 yards. My intent was to save the guy some money and boost his confidence in his choice of weapon at the same time. I could buy two boxes of over the counter at wal-mart winchester powerpoint 150's for what I could one box of Federal's 180 grain nosler partition. One box could be used to craft a ballistics chart and one to hunt with.
Confidence in what you're using matters most of all. I am convinced that whatever weight and construction bullet he chooses for the 300 short mag will work. That little short mag has a little more strength than the 30-06 and I've never doubted the 30-06 no matter the bullet weight. I do know that I can put more holes in a two inch circle at two hundred yards with a 165 grain bullet than I can a 180 grainer. My shoulder is starting to hurt just thinking about it.