[firehog]

Reading a few other states hunting message boards, I have seen some chatter about trail cams being unethical and taking away from the integrity of the sport. I guess some states are looking at banning entirely and some looking at baiting in front of trail cams. Just wondering what your take is on this subject? Here is a article from someone for banning, I thought was interesting.

TRAIL CAMS - ARE THEY GOOD FOR NORTH DAKOTA ? By Joe Ness

After spending hundreds of hours in either a blind or a tree stand each fall, some things really start to bug me ! It's usually the fact that once again the gun season is over, most of the bucks in the state are dead, and I have yet to fill my bow tag. This year however, the thing that has been bugging me for the past 4 months of sitting is the widespread use of trail cameras.

Let's face it, the whole idea of the trail cam is to make hunting and scouting easier. The concept of hunting, or not hunting, a particular area because of pictures taken in our absense seems to fly in the face of hunting ethics. I recently heard of a group of hunters "passing up" shots at some 150 class whitetail bucks because they had films of even bigger bucks in their area. They had never actually seen these bucks, but they knew they were in the neighborhood because of the pictures ! I also recently heard a friend state that he didn't need to hunt in the evening because his trail cam showed the big buck had only been hitting this spot in the morning. Or the other aquaintance that while bear hunting last spring quit hunting a certain bait because his trail cams were not showing any big or colored ones in this area.

What's next, do we soon start hunting spots as a result of our work computer showing real time shots of our hunting area, while we sit at our desks and monitor the computer periodically, then when our trophy moves in, we go home and hunt him. Don't laugh, that technology is already here. Yes, this is another one of those technology decisions we have to face. Once again we must ask ourselves if this is really good for our sport, does the end justify the means.

I'm sure the outfitters and guides love these new "advancements in technology", it makes their life a lot easier. Set up the cams, call the client and tell him that they now have the trophy located and to come on out and shoot him. This may be a bit overstated, but you must admit, it just doesn't taste right ! But it's not just the pros that are cutting these corners, it's many of us.

Unless I am missing something, I can't see any good arguments for using trail cams except to make it easier for us. I've always thought that the outthinking, and matching our skills against their innate abilities and tendencies was what it was all about. When is that big boy going to start hitting a particular area - will I be a step ahead of him, do I shoot a nice one if I don't know a bigger one is in the area, or do I hold out and risk burning my tag. These are the things we love about hunting. These are the things that keep things interesting and keep us coming back. If it just becomes a contest to shoot bigger ones and to use all the technology that is available, I'm afraid the sport of hunting will begin a downward spiral and it will burn many of us out.

Yes once again the NDBA will be at the forefront of making and helping guide the state to rational and ethical decisions that will help preserve the integrity of hunting in the state. We all know the answer to this one. It just isn't right ! I sincerely hope that our board of directors will take a stand and sponsor legislation that will outlaw the use of trail cameras in North Dakota.

 

[Manybeards]

I like them I think their one of the best management tools a person can have. He's just mad because he don't have one.

 

[huntbigbucs]

wanting to ban trail cams is flat stupid. There are probably some "hunters" that let the trail cam do all the scouting for them. But there are still those of us who use the trail cam for other reasons than scouting. Its a good chance to see animals being natural without any concern of a human being nearby and getting to see some cool, interesting and sometimes humorous things. A real hunter will still go through the steps of scouting by looking for tracks, rubs, scrapes, etc. My camera has yet to influnce my hunting decision or style. Plus a real hunter all ready knows just because you get a picture of a good buck in September does not mean he will be anywhere close come November

 

[possum]

I'm like Manybeards it's more of a management tool to let me know whats there. When a majority of your pics are at night how does that make it easier? You still have to figure were he's going to be during legal shooting hours.

 

[sam]

The main thing I like about the trail cameras is that it keeps you interested in the deer year round, I keep mine out year round and get about as big a kick out of watch'n them grow and seeing what's really out there as I do hunt'n. Unfair advantage? Get'n a picture and get'n a shot are two different things.

 

[Jam]

x2:up:

 

[MichaelT.]

This may be a bit overstated, but you must admit, it just doesn't taste right ! But it's not just the pros that are cutting these corners, it's many of us.

I believe it to be a lot overstated....


I recently heard of a group of hunters "passing up" shots at some 150 class whitetail bucks because they had films of even bigger bucks in their area.

He heard, but he does not know this to be fact ......


It's usually the fact that once again the gun season is over, most of the bucks in the state are dead, and I have yet to fill my bow tag.

First and foremost, he doesn't know squat about hunting if he believes that after a gun season that most of the bucks in the state are dead. Fact is, much less than 50% of the bucks in the start are dead. And he still has his tag to fill ..... Sounds like sour grapes to me.


I also recently heard a friend state that he didn't need to hunt in the evening because his trail cam showed the big buck had only been hitting this spot in the morning

Sounds like he has some really first class friends.... I cant believe he is still friends with this fellow since he is such a low life unethical hunter.... Or maybe the author is not as passionate about this subject as he acts.



The facts are , at least as far as my hunting is concerned, as follows.....

I use the trail cams to show me the deer herd before the season opens. I can see the buck to doe ratio, the health of the herd , and get an approx. time that the most recent fawns have dropped to get an idea of how long the buck kept breeding past Feb...

I use the cameras to see if there are any great shooter bucks in the area, and if there are, I can try to get a great pic of the Buck to hang on my wall. Will I hunt that buck?? Dang right ..... and if he walks out I will shoot him, but from several years of experience, just because you see one on the camera does not mean you will ever see it while on the stand.

I do not ever pass on a decent legal buck, because my camera showed a much bigger one 8 days ago in this area and I am holding out for him..... If he is legal and decent, I will take him if I choose to. It is my choice. If I don't take him , then that too is my choice and a chance I have to take.

And finally, if the guy is really concerned about an unfair advantage and that hunting is losing it's essence...... Then lay down your in-line muzzloader, your compound bow, your centerfire rifle ( anything above a 45-70 ), and grab you a rock, a spear, a slingshot, or a bowie knife and have at it. Experience hunting the way it originally was..... get up close and personal with your game, but in the mean time ..... learn a little more about hunting so you can fill your tag, and then get the hel* out of my way. I have a buck to load up.

God Bless

MET

 

[Bowman]

I like trail cams. They are a advancement in technology, just like new fast bows, new day time only feeders, carbon arrows, drop away rest, scents.
Why question the cam you cant kill a deer with a camera.

I like getting pics of the deer as much as I do killing one, maybe more.

 

[Hogbreath]

I think that guy is ridiculous, didn't people kill deer before they had trail cams? How many bucks have gone in the book due to a trail cam? On our lease, we've got a couple or 3 real good bucks, I've seen them, but haven't got but one picture with my trail cam, and it was of the little one of the 3. I figure he's the same one I let walk 2 years ago, I got a video of him one morning, about as much fun as killing him woulda been. Now when he gets as big as those other 2, he better look out.

 

[firehog]

I can honestly say a trail cam has not put a deer in my freezer yet. Have I taken a picture of a deer I have killed? Yes, but that deer was a quarter mile from that camera. It didn't affect how I hunted, the only thing it told me, was that deer was in the area. I guess if I had 10-20 cameras, maybe that might tell me more, but you also run the risk of scenting up your area, just checking that many. I know of the kid who killed that huge buck up in Missiouri, and his dad and uncle had around 6 trailcams up and they claimed to know this bucks habits real well and they killed him. They layed claim to the cameras helping tremendously, but I have not experinced that personally.

I run two trailcams and they stay out in season, 2-3 weeks at a time, between checks. If I get pictures the only thing it tells me, is that deer was in front of it at that particular time. And it is mostly at night. I have never got a mature buck consistantly in the daytime on a trailcam. But I don't go the exact mile to cover all my scent either.

Does those pictures keep me from killing certain bucks because I know a bigger one is in the area? No, not for me. I don't personally believe its a ethical question, but it does seem like some hunters do. I always go back when our fellow hunters start bringing up these ethical questions about certain methods and practices, and look in the eyes of a anti hunter and see that many things may or maynot be ethical in their eyes. But it amazes me when hunters start knocking certain practices, when really you open up a whole box of other potential ethical practices when you get down to it.

We as hunters must realize its a very thin line, when we bring up ethics in hunting as a issue. There are a few things I have agreed with when dealing with degrading our sport, hunting with computer aided guns from your computer is one I agreed with. But taking a picture of a deer is not one I agree with as far as compromising our sport.

 

[Manybeards]

MT tell us how ya really feel :biggrin:

 

[firehog]

How many bucks have gone in the book due to a trail cam?

I read that the Boone & Crockett Club will no longer accept entries for animals that have been harvested with the aid of electronic devices (including cameras that send pictures.)

 

[Whiskey River]

It has become more of a hobby for me. I love running cameras almost year around. You never know what you're gonna see when you pull those pictures up. They have also helped me to learn a lot about deer movement and travel patterns. I never would have thought that deer would travel as far as they do if I hadn't seen it through my cameras the past few years.

 

[sam]

What got me about the rant was he was complain'n about all the unfairness of the cameras and all the deer be'n killed, then he got mad because someone passed up on a cople of 150 class deer, what's he say'n,they should kill'em all or are they kill'n too many?:head:

 

[MichaelT.]

MT tell us how ya really feel :biggrin:

Ok Ok , I hear ya.... I've calmed down now. It's just that PETA huggers like this guy, passing judgement on all other hunters because he cannot fill a tag , really gets my dander up. I usually have three cameras out , at feeder locations, and I have only shot one buck I had a picture of, and he was not near the feeder or camera. But Idid take him, and later inthe season see 2 or 3 other bucks that were bigger than him, but I never got the 1st picture of any of them.....

SOOOOOOO what does that say about his rediculus theory???:smack:

A few folks here and there go out and get drunk and drive and have wrecks, so we should ban beer and alcohol and cars too, because everyone might do it??

MET

Off of my soapbox now.......

 

[MichaelT.]

Oh and BTW ... If I am hunting on private land, what I do makes no difference to him and his hunting..... If he is hunting on private land, then he can do what he wants. On public land he needs to find the big bucks before the other guys, or go out and shoot those scrub 150 class bucks those other guys passed on..... Problem solved...

MET

 

[huntindoc]

I can honestly say a trail cam has not put a deer in my freezer yet. Have I taken a picture of a deer I have killed? Yes, but that deer was a quarter mile from that camera. It didn't affect how I hunted, the only thing it told me, was that deer was in the area. I guess if I had 10-20 cameras, maybe that might tell me more, but you also run the risk of scenting up your area, just checking that many. I know of the kid who killed that huge buck up in Missiouri, and his dad and uncle had around 6 trailcams up and they claimed to know this bucks habits real well and they killed him. They layed claim to the cameras helping tremendously, but I have not experinced that personally.

I run two trailcams and they stay out in season, 2-3 weeks at a time, between checks. If I get pictures the only thing it tells me, is that deer was in front of it at that particular time. And it is mostly at night. I have never got a mature buck consistantly in the daytime on a trailcam. But I don't go the exact mile to cover all my scent either.

Does those pictures keep me from killing certain bucks because I know a bigger one is in the area? No, not for me. I don't personally believe its a ethical question, but it does seem like some hunters do. I always go back when our fellow hunters start bringing up these ethical questions about certain methods and practices, and look in the eyes of a anti hunter and see that many things may or maynot be ethical in their eyes. But it amazes me when hunters start knocking certain practices, when really you open up a whole box of other potential ethical practices when you get down to it.

We as hunters must realize its a very thin line, when we bring up ethics in hunting as a issue. There are a few things I have agreed with when dealing with degrading our sport, hunting with computer aided guns from your computer is one I agreed with. But taking a picture of a deer is not one I agree with as far as compromising our sport.

+1

It's really a hobby for me. Not once has it helped me kill a deer. Heck it's my scouting that helps me choose where my camera gets set up not vice versa.

hd

 

[MichaelT.]

+100 there hd .... thats the perfect way to describe it.

 

[readytoshootsumtin]

Trail cams are a great tool for knowing what you have on your property, I get just as excited getting a huge buck on film as I do, well almost as much as putting a arrow thru one

 

[Down on the White]

wanting to ban trail cams is flat stupid. There are probably some "hunters" that let the trail cam do all the scouting for them. But there are still those of us who use the trail cam for other reasons than scouting. Its a good chance to see animals being natural without any concern of a human being nearby and getting to see some cool, interesting and sometimes humorous things. A real hunter will still go through the steps of scouting by looking for tracks, rubs, scrapes, etc. My camera has yet to influnce my hunting decision or style. Plus a real hunter all ready knows just because you get a picture of a good buck in September does not mean he will be anywhere close come November

X2 for your statement.